8-Figure Copywriting Secrets | Private Interview With Craig Clemens, The Best Copywriter Alive

Home > Back

8-Figure Copywriting Secrets | Private Interview With Craig Clemens, The Best Copywriter Alive

test test


Take a glance see what they’re selling see the general hook but then put them away do not have those out when you’re writing because if you’re studying other people stuff I have this theory that you will at best be 80% as good as the original stuff let’s start here and we’ll see where this goes you have for some reason you have to write a kick-ass VSL in 30 days where do you start so my process is probably different than the process other people should use because I can sit down and write it without doing a ton of prep because I’ve been doing this a long time yes what I suggest to other people is to first immerse themselves in the market they’re trying to go after and this is something that if you’re a business owner you’re probably already immersed you probably already know what’s going on in the industry you probably know what all your competitors are selling you know your advantages but if you’re a freelance copywriter then you might be diving into something new so you know let’s say you get hired to write a sales promotion for a women’s beauty products yes I have Cosmo magazine buy a glamour magazine read Us Weekly or People magazine look at the ads see what everyone else is selling see the type of pain points they’re talking about or the fears and so alright so in situations when you’re maybe they will go back in time right and yeah because you were freelancing at certain points and you so you’d say to women actually I freelanced once is that right yeah I was really fortunate so I started working for eben pagan who you know and I worked for him for five years writing dating advice copy and then the recession hit I got laid off and I needed a some kind of job to pay the bills you know so I did one freelance copy project for Joe polish okay and then my brothers and I got together with another gentleman and it started the company that became golden hippo okay awesome all right so only one time freelance and it was with drill polish does probably market you probably understood pretty well actually it was not so it’s a good example okay Joe at the time had the largest marketing program for carpets cleaners he was teaching carpet cleaners how to grow their carpet cleaning businesses so how to go from like a one van operate chené where you’re the one actually like out there vacuuming and shipping the carpets to how to multiple vans and you just sit and wear dolce gabbana sandals ideally maroon yes yeah actually I think that’s an ox blood yeah ox blood right yeah yeah for the record let’s just state yeah so I decided to dive in and figure out what is it that makes these carpet cleaners tick what are their hopes and dreams and fears and frustrations so the first thing I did was I asked Joe it’s like what are these guys looking for what are your competitors look like what is gonna get them really excited is it really a multi event operation or do they not want to have that responsibility would they rather just have their one van and be able to charge a ton of money for each job so they do less jobs what is it really what do they want and then the next step I suggest people do is if you can talk to those business owners I wasn’t able to do that but I was able to watch the testimonials from Joe’s group in the previous years when people get on stage and talk about the success they had with Joe’s marketing program so they would get up and they would say yeah you know I was working for someone else I would ride in their van and I would be the one that had to do the cleaning when it was a hundred degrees outside in Phoenix and the places that had no air-conditioning and it was terrible and I was able to use Joe’s material to start off on my own and get my own van or there’d be someone who said you know I had two vans and business was okay but my kids wanted to go to Disney World and I couldn’t afford that I used these secrets to spend now we have 17 vans I work less than ever and when we go to Disney World we all fly first-class things like that you know yeah so you learned what they’re looking for yeah was what they were looking for different than what you expected them to be looking for well there’s those nuances because you want to not promise the world but you want to promise big you know so I knew that they would want to make more money with less work that’s a universal truth less stressed out I knew a lot of people who start their own businesses are basically like starting themselves a job that can be more hours than the one that they left you know and even become a full-time entrepreneur so I know talking about less stress better systems in place that you don’t have to worry about and I also knew that they were all gonna want more clients because in any business the more clients you have the more money you make so I knew that I was gonna focus on client getting strategies less stress mo money it’s pretty Universal across any type of biz op type of thing so you before you said you you don’t want to make these huge claims or promises but you do want to have a a big promise in there what do you say that what is the distinction that you’re kind of making yeah so you want to sell the dream as they say but they have to hear you talking about that dream and there can be a hint of like wow could that really happen could I really fly my whole family first-class but it can’t be unbelievable it can’t be like you know by the time you get this course you’re gonna find that you’re flying in the g6 with two flight attendants to play with your kids while you have your back rubbed and grapes fed to you and your own private plane it’s like no but flying your family first-class is something you can imagine could possibly happen to you if you have a really successful carpet cleaning operation the other thing is just too unrealistic yeah you know so you do want to sell the dream but it has to be believable yeah so you talked about in your teachings that you’re creating a hundred millionaires students and you have a few already yeah that’s very believable if you said my goal in life is to create more billionaires than Microsoft did when it went public like get the out yeah or you know even like a hundred millionaires if you’re like you know ten people in this room are gonna be having a hundred million net worth within the next five years like that actually is like distantly possible but it’s too far along it’s too big of a stretch if you say I’m gonna create a hundred million our students and I already have five they’re like okay that’s believable that’s something I can picture for myself I could be one of those yeah yeah I remember when I first started selling make money stuff a few years ago I did on a little bit mentoring with John Carlton and he looked at some my stuff and he was like you need he’s like everything we’re promising 15 grand a month and he would drop it by 90% I was like yeah girls don’t like promise $1500 and it worked and I think it’s a guy who what you’re talking about you yeah yeah one thing I got from John Carlton also is the strength of E’s promising ease so I talked to John Carlton when I was selling dating advice products which was my first copywriting gig I worked there full time and I remember he was speaking in a program I got up to ask him a question I don’t remember what my question was but he told me something interesting he said Craig you gotta understand when you’re selling dating advice no one wants to buy the book read through a hundred pages go out practice the techniques get rejected like 90% of the time you know and then hopefully end up having a few dates they want to take a pill and wake up next to a hot blonde where Bill Cosby’s case he wants to give the blonde a pill not wake up until he’s gone that’s a different type of persuasion yeah we’re not gonna but John said that and it was a huge AHA to me and I just made me realize that this one phrase I think about think about this what I’m selling anything and that is no one wants to read your book none of these authors no matter how good your book is no one wants to read the book I mean if it’s a fiction book or a book of stories yes but Tim Ferriss best-selling business book of one of the decades 4-hour workweek do you want to read the 4-hour worker and you want to wall might have to work four hours in a week right that’s what people want right so give them the ease of getting that thing do you ever when you’re putting together copy maybe not now at some point earlier where you’d be writing and you realize you’re talking too much about the book as opposed to the ease and you catch yourself and like does that ever happen to you and editing process like how does that work not anymore yeah but it used to you know you can think about this when you’re talking about whatever it is you’re selling you know you can be like yo yeah you’re gonna go out and you’re gonna practice and you’re gonna practice and like yeah you’re gonna your hard knocks but you’re gonna persevere and like we’re gonna give you these techniques to persevere you know in your business be like don’t say that that like like if you’re creating a bonus for your business growth course your bonus can be like strength and perseverance I’m gonna teach you how to persevere when the times are tough that could be an interesting bonus but what would sell better as a bonus would be I’m gonna give you this accounting software so you can keep track of all the money arriving yeah it’s gonna do it for you yeah yeah so what are you are you familiar with like Jocko willing yes I love his book extreme ownership I haven’t read the whole thing but I loved the concept and I shared a lot with my team members that’s awesome yeah so like he’s becoming very popular obviously in our culture and Joe Rogan talks about him a lot and this discipline extreme ownership thing yeah and so many people get juiced about that and they follow him and stuff and yet what you’re saying goes like he couldn’t sell that right so what do you think about like the I mean I know a lot of guys that say 18 to 44 who they like jockle and they want ya strength and talk and discipline yeah are they just saying that and they don’t actually want to buy that concept well you know like we said in dating is people come in for the pickup lines and they stay for the confidence yeah because they think that they need one thing but then what they really need is something else so when you sell dating advice you tell them that the pickup lines are going to be in there but you also tell them if you if you’re ethical that they’re gonna learn the inner game skills is we’re gonna make them more confident and more naturally attractive so I guess you know in thinking about selling extreme ownership if it was a course or something like that you’d want to sell the benefits of it like when you have this you’re gonna be able to do the things you’ve been talking about thinking about dreaming about that you’ve never gotten done you’re gonna write that book you’re gonna build that business you’re gonna like have those conversations with your loved ones that you’ve been putting off you’re gonna be able to get yourself to do things yeah so sell the benefits even if the work is hard if the benefits are strong enough people will do the work so focus on the benefits great okay so we’re talking about you you read Cosmo magazine you read all this stuff so you don’t know the market so now you can understand what are the pain points are talking about do you somehow codify all those pain points and benefits and stuff are you just kind of trying to download them at the start so at first download them and the one thing I recommend you do not do is don’t look too closely at the competitors ads take a glance see what they’re selling see the general hook but then put them away do not have those out when you’re writing because if you’re studying other people stuff I have this theory that you will at best be 80% as good as the original stuff so you want to be able to create something original that is above and beyond thought there’s stuff in there and it’s by combining all that knowledge in your head that’s going to come out yeah that’s a very very whole beveren or that all right so you taken all this to take it all in what’s next and then you really want to think about who your prospect is so my favorite definition of copywriting is from Eugene Schwartz the great copywriter of the 70s and 80s and he says you must enter the conversation your prospect is having in their own mind and so to be able to do that you need to think about who your prospect is so an exercise I learned from Evan is to sit down and write an autobiography as your prospect so who’s your prospect fry status summit like give me like an avatar think of someone like an a name of someone or just described either I mean he’s 24 he drives an uber on the weekends and has a normal job okay he’s all these people making money online he feels me he’s the only one who’s not doing it what is his name Jim Jim okay great tell me more I sure Jim I graduated four he’s a bachelor’s degree wait wait you’re Jim tell me more yeah you’re Jim no no no you’re Jim you urgently no you’re being autobiographical yeah that’s you yeah all right yeah this is an exercise first you think about it that needs to take it and taking him on so I I missed the college days when I hang out with my bros and you drunk with them and life was fun and now life sucks and everyone’s got a job and I don’t get to see my friends anymore and I have this normal job and it’s not at all what I thought it would be it sucks there’s so much bureaucracy I hate my coworkers I jerk-off too much and I watched too much Netflix and I can’t stop and I dragged uber on the weekend and I try and pick chicks in the backs of the league’s I don’t be weird but that doesn’t work either and my parents are getting down my ass because they’re like what are you gonna do you get this job you don’t care about mmm and I try to go to the gym but try to go five days I only go two days I’m joking about that all the time yeah I ordered pizza – I am sometimes too much at the end 10 pounds college as well so I’m freaking out about that max girlfriend is here on Facebook she’s a new boyfriend from college he’s way better looking he’s got a six-pack I hate him and I’m just really angry because it feels like everyone is succeeding and that was a fantastic how you tapped me all those emotions those little frustrations the big wants and desires the feeling of seeing everyone else succeed but you the feeling of having that anger loneliness yeah beating yourself up yeah perfect so you want to tap into all that you were doing it for women’s cosmetics you might be Jane who’s 43 years old has 3 kids her husband they have an OK relationship but she wishes he would initiate sex more and she started to feel unattractive her girlfriends you know their husbands are taking them off to like you know romantic weekends and she doesn’t have one of those in a while she wonders if it’s because you know he’s looking at other women or somebody you know getting really into that that’s the way to do it so then the next level of that is sitting down to write to that person okay but now it’s not you anymore and it’s not random gym off the street it’s your cousin Jim who you really care about you really want this person to be successful and what that does is that turns you from a salesperson into a friend and that takes your copy to another level because do you have somebody like Jason that you’ve really wanted to help with something and they just wouldn’t do it like maybe it’s your you know wife cousin best friend or something that oh yeah okay what was the thing there’s something coming to mind yeah is someone who wanted to start their own online business okay and tried to sell their told me one time and just gave up okay got it so if I bring in someone from the conference into this room you’re good at starting online businesses you’re one of the best in the world you know how to do it yeah you probably have a course that shows them how to do it and you said it yours or cousin it wasn’t a cousin yet it’s a family member okay family member you know your course would do that right if you got a random person from the street here and then you got your family member and you’re gonna convince one of them to or both of them to try your course who are you gonna close harder right so that is the secret to closing strong without being salesy because with that family member you’re not gonna be saying like you know Jim if you buy now I’m gonna throw in a bunch of bonuses but if you don’t you know you’re gonna miss out yeah you’re not gonna say well Jim you know this is a thousand dollars or the value and I’m gonna give it to you for 50 bucks no you’re gonna be like Jim listen to me man I’ve been in your shoes I know what it’s like to be frustrated with the way things are going I also know what it’s like to finally take that first step and see that first dollar come in and then another and another and then get that like you don’t realize that wow I can go eat lunch at any restaurant I want today and not even look at the bill at the end I realize what it’s like to go apartment shopping and go to the nicest block in your neighborhood and walk into the penthouse apartment and say I’ll take it I know how that feels and this could be you man but you need to get off your ass you’ve been around for too long the map is right here for you you just need to do it man it’s right here you just need to do it so please do it man I promise you this is gonna work that’s the key that’s that’s what I call compassionate closing I think I’ve just said this to my wife last night I just came up with this I’m gonna say it in all my talks closing is caring it really is if you made a product that you’re proud of that you think is really gonna help people then getting them to buy it is caring it’s caring for them if you made a product closing is not carrying closing is scamming if you made a great product than closing is caring it’s a closed heart I think I was one of the best copy exercises I’ve ever heard all right great awesome yeah so yeah and yeah yeah I was awesome so you do the research get inside them when you do that about our graphical exercise do you ever fact check it with them in reality to see to make sure you’re not projecting things that aren’t aren’t actually there that’s a great question so the way to avoid that is to not say exact specifics so let me give you an example let’s say you’re selling a dating advice course and your avatar is James who’s 32 years old just got out of a marriage just got divorced he’s going back in the street and he’s meeting women and you know who got a phone number once in a while but you know it doesn’t always get a callback and look at a first date once in a while but doesn’t always get a second date and when it gets a third or fourth date he finds it’s a woman he’s just not that interested in hey just in this pickle you know and he really likes blondes and like you know it feels like the women and he likes that they’re just like they want the models and the rich guys and they’re not going for him you know so the way to screw this up the way I view this wrong is when you’re writing your promotion and saying something like hey have you ever met a sexy blonde girl who was just your type got her phone number had a great phone call even had a great first date and then she didn’t return your call it’s too specific because if someone’s reading that and they were like well I’m an Asian women so no I am NOT and I use tinder so I don’t meet women in public I’m too shy for that but if you’ve worked it like this and be like have you ever met a woman that was just your type and it felt like there was really a spark there but then for some reason you never ended up having things go anywhere with her and you couldn’t figure out why then they’re like oh yeah there was a girl on tinder we had like a hundred great conversations we went on a great first date she disappeared I don’t know why or the other guy can be like yeah I met this you know Maxim model everything was going great with her at the bar we made out she gave me her phone number when I called she didn’t write back when I text she didn’t write back I finally showed up at her house and she’s like get the out of your creeper he replies to him – yeah yeah so making Universal statements that they can choose their own adventure write their own story fill in the blanks for themselves yeah is the key to do it but you’re still writing that person it’s just allowing everyone to be a part of it without being too specific yeah so good so alright looks like so once you you have this and you start writing do you I mean do you do the whole I write headlines first and then I like yeah how do you what do you do so this is the first time I’ve revealed this anywhere it used to be that copywriting is about one big idea now it’s about two big ideas there’s the big idea for your product or service and how it’s gonna help them and then there’s a big idea of why they should watch your ad first you need to have the big idea on why they should stop scrolling and watch your ad then you have the big idea of what your product is gonna do for them so two big ideas so think about both of those and then obviously if the first one the big idea why they should watch your ad doesn’t click they’re not gonna get to your next big idea so make that one really juicy and so do your two ads note that you need two big ideas do they have to be congruent with each other or can they be separate because one is all about to click and the other is yeah that’s a great question if you’re doing a speech they don’t have to have anything to do with each other so I just look at your program downstairs and I told a lot of stories and one of my stories talks about how I was prank calling people selling them penis pills it was a prank call and then through that I prank called my person who became my mentor Evan and he hung up on me during the prank call and then I learned something from him about how to give value first in business and that was the secret number three that’s all about the prank call story has nothing to do with secret number three that I shared with but it’s really funny and it keeps the crowd engaged so I’m glad you asked that question because I hadn’t thought about that I’m gonna say I need to think about it more but now I’m thinking about like like poopourri ads or like purple mattress or Dollar Shave Club those are just kind of funny and maybe if Dollar Shave Club maybe if he wasn’t selling razors maybe if he was selling deodorant or something that would had work just as well I don’t know you didn’t you just kind of went in there for the humor cuz was the big idea of that yeah very interesting it’s funny as you said the two big idea thing I look back on every winning campaign I had and that was president and the ones that wasn’t it was it wasn’t quite I you put words on something that I’ve seen and that’s yeah awesome all right well dude thank you so much for sharing and reviewing some stuff you never shared before you are you are seriously just a treasure trove of like marketing and persuasion information so I really appreciate you in here thank you appreciate it yeah yeah great chat with you is always good to be a part of this I’ll see you in Porto Rico sir yes cool why would a millionaire show you how to have a full time paycheck without having a job at all it’s because I just wrote my brand-new book it’s called screw jobs it’s totally free no strings attached and hit the link below you download it for free right now in two seconds if you want and here’s the thing see I have never had a job in my entire life yet I became a millionaire when I was 24 years old in the last 12 months I’ve helped over 150 people from over 60 countries begin to earn a full-time income as well without having a job this is the digital age we don’t need jobs to live life on our terms and do the things that we want so if you want to get my brand new book it’s completely free for the rest of today just hit the link below you’ll get it in literally less than a minute and part of this book by the way was dedicated to my college professor who told me I would never amount to anything so there’s anyone your life doesn’t believe in you doubts who says you can’t do it get this book and let’s show them what you truly are capable of Up next

Demand generation 101 bookDemand generation 101 book

Get the Strategies

Get the latest posts delivered to your inbox for free.

Posted by Ian

Ian has marketed for some of the world's best-known brands like Hewlett-Packard, Ryder, Force Factor, and CIT Bank. His content has been downloaded 50,000+ times and viewed by over 90% of the Fortune 500. His marketing has been featured in Forbes, Inc. Magazine, Adweek, Business Insider, Seeking Alpha, Tech Crunch, Y Combinator, and Lifehacker. With over 10 startups under his belt, Ian's been described as a serial entrepreneur— a badge he wears with pride. Ian's a published author and musician and when he's not obsessively testing the next marketing idea, he can be found hanging out with family and friends north of Boston.

Subscribe to Forward Weekly

Related videos

Leave a Reply


Get the Guide

You'll learn how to:

  • Generate more demand for your product or service
  • What channels to start with at first
  • Strategies to maximize your lead generation
  • And so much more!